posted 31 January 2010 13:11
Missoula seems to be the new kids in the block in junior hockey for padding their attendence. One of the moles in the Zoo told me that he they were under 600 vs. Helena on Friday and a little over that amount on Saturday. They reported crowds of 1400 plus and 1300 plus respectively.
Have these guys lost their minds? I'm sure they could fluff the crowd by 100 or so and most of is could not tell. The report from Mizzou is 500 plus boosts. My question is why? You fans are smart. They will eventually see through it. What do you possibly have to gain by lying to them?
The T-Birds used to pad their fan base at games by the same ratio a few years ago and those in attendence all laughed in unison. It was quite funny.
I hear the Mauler$ scorekeeper is none other than the owner. You know, the same guy who basked in his anonymity on here only to bear his real name to the thunderous guffaws. It does explain a lot. Like why visiting teams' players get so few assists when they travel to the city of all things embelleshed. With my hand on the trigger, I would run the Totems total up the same 300%...which would be around 140.
Posts: 118 | From: Top of the slot | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged
SweetP
Ref
Member # 4517
posted 31 January 2010 19:56
Shooter - Why are you so he## bent on creating a conspiracy theory? We all know teams pad their attendance count. Whatever. As far as the Missoula count? My niece attends college in that city. Tell me this, what else is there to do in Missoula but attend hockey games? It's Girl Scout cookie time, why don't you bother them for a while?
--------------------
Hockey: If only it came in a bottle!
Posts: 2157 | From: Hockeyland, USA | Registered: Oct 2004 | IP: Logged
Decider
Vet
Member # 540
posted 01 February 2010 08:19
" run the totems up 300%.... and have about 140" Now that's some funny sh--. Maybe the big building makes it look like there are less people? They should count like the WHL, go to the parking lot, count the cars and multiply by 5.
--------------------
For a better outlook, clean your window !! Reality is an illusion brought on by lack of alcohol.
Posts: 298 | From: Zebra Zone | Registered: Jan 2002 | IP: Logged
Shooter16
Vet
Member # 6139
posted 01 February 2010 21:38
Ah, blessed Pea. Just what do you have against girls scouts? I love their cookies, especially the Grasshoppers.
You see, the girl scouts deal in honesty. They sell cookies. They tell you how much. They tell you how many. They operate above board.
I do not sit around twirling my mustache thinking about plausable theories as to how junior teams operate. You have read stuff long enough to figure out the simplicity and basis of my points.
Simply put, don't lie, don't cheat and don't act with a low degree of class and you will stay off the radar.
There is no conspiracy here. Missoula grossly exaggerates their attendance figures. I'll make it even simpler for you. They lie about their attendence. And based on the figures vs. the reports and estimates, they are pretty big liars.
Make no mistake. They aren't the only ones. The have broken no law. They won't go to jail. But they are guilty of misleading all who look to that data to tell a story.
It is no different than the timekeepers who have a kid who plays and grossly inflate their stats. It may not be illegal but it is morally wrong.
This is not a witch hunt Not So Sweet Pea. This is a call for the truth. It sucks that us fans of the game have to constantly sift through the BS that comes from the multitude of teams who feel the only way they can be successful is to fabricate or embellish news to paint their picture.
I watch NHL games on the tube. The building looks empty and I read they were 80% full in the boxscores the next day.
I say it again. Simply don't lie to us as fans and you can spare the time wasted reading about it and I don't have to explain to posters who are from other leagues with really no dog in the fight, why I get ticked off.
Posts: 118 | From: Top of the slot | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged
SweetP
Ref
Member # 4517
posted 01 February 2010 21:51
Oh Dear Shoot me in the foot: I have absolutly nothing against the Girl Scouts. I still have my sash full of merit badges. 1st one me thinks is in story telling. Attendance hype? Who cares? I watched games on the internet where they claimed 500 were in attendance, with a quick sweep of the camera, I knew better. As long as players are doing their job on the ice & the paperwork is above reproach, let's enjoy the greatest game on the planet.
--------------------
Hockey: If only it came in a bottle!
Posts: 2157 | From: Hockeyland, USA | Registered: Oct 2004 | IP: Logged
Playmaker09
Vet
Member # 1043
posted 02 February 2010 11:52
Here is why teams pad the attendence stats. Simple its so when they go out and look for new and old sponsers they can say look we have x amount of fans attending every game. So then the sponsor is like wow i can get my name out to all those people. Then when the sponsor shows up and asked where are the people were they can say oh it was a bad night.
Is it right no Is it right maybe but it only hurts when ya go look for sponsorship for the following season. After about 5 years of doing this the sponsorship will be all used up.
posted 02 February 2010 14:15
Oh, now I get it. Thanks, Plamaker. I had it all wrong. I thought these people just lied to their fans about their attendence. Now, it has been revealed that teams do this to lie to their sponsors too. I am soooooo stupid.
In reality, attendence fluffing is really not the biggest thing that bugs me about some of the cretins in the game. It mildly irks me. However, it is one thing in a list of many to clean up. I have been watching this game a long time and this league has gotten better over the past few years. I just don't want to see the bubble burst.
Yes, Pea, it is no big deal but behind little white lies are big fat liars. If marajuana is the "Gateway Drug," then is attendence fluffing the "Gateway Lie?" Maybe the Missoula owner or anyone other team owners who fluff their attendence could grace is with their reasons. Mt Hockey Fan a.k.a. Missoula owner has not been heard from since he came out. Come to think of it, we have not heard from many Norpac dudes in awhile. Butters used to be a regular, he has vanished to the big leagues. The Yellow coach was always on. He bolted. Pugets old coach was always on here. What gives??
Posts: 118 | From: Top of the slot | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged
madmax
Vet
Member # 6113
posted 02 February 2010 17:53
I can't comment on where all the posters went, just wanted to throw my 2 cents at the attendance comments. I do know that season ticket holder numbers are thrown into the mix attending or not. This could lead some to see low numbers in the crowd, then guffaw at the announced numbers. S-16 do you know the number of season ticket holders of the accused? Not defending, just slowly stirring.......You seem to know sooo much.
posted 03 February 2010 09:58
Butte should try padding their numbers ! Maybe they will get more than 10 people at a game! Well I guess it helps if your market the team, can produce a winning team helps also, oh and lets not forget about paying their bills that helps too. Sorry about bashing Butte but they need to step up and run it like it should be run !
--------------------
Nice hit sissy!
Posts: 177 | From: Hockey Falls | Registered: May 2002 | IP: Logged
Centerman
Vet
Member # 6444
posted 03 February 2010 13:30
A new month a new Shooter acusation against the Mauler owner. If the attendance numbers are inflated, who cares. I do know the Maulers scan each ticket used for admission, so from a technology standpoint, they should be able to report accurate numbers, if they don't only they would know why they aren't.
Lost in this attendance discussion is a more sinister jab, that because the owner is the announcer he is somehow shorting visiting players assists. Given that its is the referee who reports scorers and assists and who msut certify the score sheet this seems unlikely, but again, it is shooter. And for all we know Michael Burks is somehow killing shooter with with an outer space death ray.
I am sure shooter will attempt to flame me for these comments, but alas I take my chances. I will say this about the Missoula game day operations, they are by far the best in the AW side of the league. Having attended games in Butte, Billings, Helena and Missoula for pure entertainment, the Maulers put on a better show than the rest. Does this result in higher attendance? I would think so. Are the numbers accurate? Can't say. So unlike shooter, I won't.
posted 03 February 2010 15:10
Awwww, Centerman. Why would I roast you? You mad your stand in you comments about a game that featured a great defensive battle that featured several scoring chances as boring. Hey, we already plucked that cherub. No need to digress. But to simply brush off a subject with a "who cares?" really doesn't fly with me. Why? Because I care. Not a great deal but I care.
Yes I brought up the stats thing. Why? Because it has happened in Norpac before, more than once. It is not uncommon. While it does stand that the donkeys who don the black and white are either too lazy or too brutal to grab second assists, they should. So some of these guys who sit in the sin bin and add assists is something they do on occassion. While they may think they are doing the right thing, they aren't. These guys should write down what the refs say. They don't.
This is not a sole scud missle launched at Missoula. They just happen to be the latest guys who seem to think that we aren't watching. I will bring to attention any team or individual who treat us like idiots. Just because they happen to brew the Kool Aid and serve it in these parts, doesn't mean we, as fans, have to blindly drink it. They tried it in Eugene with the Thunder. They tried in Ft. Vancouver with Pizza Joe. And now these guys seem to be heading down that same path. While what they do isn't the same, the outcome is the same, they insult us fans who help support their livelihood.
So, centerman, if you want to trivialize my observations, no problem. Simply stop posting or having opinions on all things Norpac.
I rarely agree with your opinions. But, this board works because people like me respect that you have an opinion. That's what makes this fun. So instead of crying about it, I am going to count my lucky stars that we have a 17-14 game soon so I can hear from you about what great hockey you saw.
Posts: 118 | From: Top of the slot | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged
spinazza1
Vet
Member # 1491
posted 03 February 2010 15:33
so, other than whine about any and everything Shooter, what have you done to improve hockey? If the scorekeepers suck--go show them how to do it. If the owners don't know how to own a team, go buy one. If the refs are donkeys, lace em up and get out there. My guess is that attendance around the league would double just to see YOU make a a** of yourself. When was the last time you volunteered to help do anything for NorPac?
It's easy to sit in the stands and ***** like Rosie O'Donnell. It's hard to try and make things better. The constant whining and innuendo is better suited for girls soccer, not hockey.
posted 04 February 2010 08:29
What have I done for hockey? Well to begin with, I have pointed out things in the game that I find either peculiar or down right wrong (IMHO) and I bring to this board for discussion. You see, through my goggles, noone is above the law. In this case, the law is the morals, ethics traditions and standards of this great game. While I may not know all of these things and may not adhere to them, I bring them out in the open for discussion.
Yes my post have a certain acerbic bite to them. So what? It is merely my writing style.
As you are so defensive of referees and by reading your previous posts, I am guessing you are one. It matters not. My point was not to villify refs. However, if you think for a second that you are above reproach then you are just as bad as the people and teams I comment about.
The chat rooms are merely entertainment, albeit sick entertainment. Most of the things written in here lack substance, proof, verification, etc. But when I bring up things like misleading attendence figures, lack of assists on scoresheets and posters who have claimed sainthood for exposing their names after the fact, I am the one being attacked. It's quite hilarious really. Numbers don't lie. Scoresheets don't lie. People lie.
Another thing, before you whip out your best one liner to retort to a comment, read it carefully. Don't brush off a subject with "who cares." put some thought into bashing me or whoever else has an opinion. The reason I write the fodder I do is because I do care. I want to see the operators in this game who take our money, do so with a degree of honesty. I want to go to a game where a ref actually puts thought into which two players assisted on a goal. I don't care if they make a mistake. Just make the effort. After all, refs get paid. Owners get paid. Coaches get paid. As such, you are not above critisim from the people who pay. Granted it isn't much. But neither is the time or effort you should spend worrying about what guys like me have to say.
Here's the thing that will crush your spirit....it's an opinion. You have yours. I have mine. I will try to prove mine with observations and sometimes facts. So far, the best response to the assertion that owners fluff their stats is "who cares."
I would think that the other 11 owners who are trying to fill their buildings and reach attendence goals care when one guy cheats the system.
I would think that you, spizazio referee guy, care if you see refs neglect their duties to provide accurate information while you work hard to do so.
I would think that all the silent masses of timekeepers out there who accurately record what the refs tell them to would take offense to the rubarbs out there who think they wield an electronic sword each time they add an unearned assist to their favorite guy...or even relative.
In closing, I ask you to read the above point a few posts ago. I really don't think fluffing attendence is the biggest deal. I just chose to bring light to it.
Would you rather me write about the team who caught one of their players smoking dope...not once but twice and merely suspended the kid for a few games. I could go there and name names and such. But why bother?
Who Cares? Right?
Posts: 118 | From: Top of the slot | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged
Decider
Vet
Member # 540
posted 04 February 2010 09:02
Spinazza is not a currently registered Official. I do know in the past he has been a Coach, manager, Played in more than a couple National Championships, both at Junior and senior levels, Officiated at Major Junior level and has been suspected of cheating on his golf score(+4). Haven't heard from him in some time, good to have a mix of opinions. Shooter, locate your spell check key(:-
--------------------
For a better outlook, clean your window !! Reality is an illusion brought on by lack of alcohol.
Posts: 298 | From: Zebra Zone | Registered: Jan 2002 | IP: Logged
Playmaker09
Vet
Member # 1043
posted 04 February 2010 14:24
Hey Lord Stanley, You know alot about the Butte team but how do you know about them not paying the bills?
Second if you think you can run the team step up buy it and lets see if you can do better with it!!!
posted 04 February 2010 20:41
Just my two cents on the "who cares" comment. Ask any player who has been recruited by Missoula and they will tell you they have been told they have the largest crowd in NORPAC and these days thats enough for some kids to commit.
Posts: 4 | From: Helena Mt. | Registered: Apr 2008 | IP: Logged
CleverCat
Vet
Member # 6118
posted 05 February 2010 14:35
Decider, you recruiting Spinazza? -- sounds like he's got some good credentials, aside from the golf score. <hehe>
posted 05 February 2010 15:38
Miss Kitty, Would never "recruit" the Spinner. His Golf game is far above anything I have ever done. However, he has some friends that are a little strange such as "steel pole", figure that one out on your own.
--------------------
For a better outlook, clean your window !! Reality is an illusion brought on by lack of alcohol.
Posts: 298 | From: Zebra Zone | Registered: Jan 2002 | IP: Logged
spinazza1
Vet
Member # 1491
posted 05 February 2010 15:38
wow-looks like I hit a nerve. Shooter, do you think you're breaking news with your constant shots at Missoula? If so, keep it up. As an "old" official, I have tough skin, so your shots at me don't really matter. Of course you missed my point, which was rather than act like Rosie O'Donnell or Ellen DeGeneress on everything, try and do some good by helping out. If all you do is complain, after a while people get tired of you. And of course I didn't hear you volunteer to step up and do anything. I will volunteer to pay your registration fee to become an official. Decider will I'm sure gladly accept your registration. Then we all can have a poll on who is the bigger donkey--you or the current crew of NORPAC officials. Having been lucky enough to work with almost all of them, I can say they are a pretty good bunch, compared to what you may get in other parts of the country.
Posts: 50 | From: cda,id | Registered: Aug 2002 | IP: Logged
CleverCat
Vet
Member # 6118
posted 07 February 2010 15:12
"STEEL POLE" -- humm.. ok ya got me on that one. ..I'll be thinking for a bit.
posted 09 February 2010 09:11
Hey Playmaker , You were involved with the team you know how they operate ! Nothing has changed !! I just don't see how anyone can survive when they have only 8 to 10 players and no one in the stands, that dosen't pay the bills
--------------------
Nice hit sissy!
Posts: 177 | From: Hockey Falls | Registered: May 2002 | IP: Logged
posted 31 January 2010 13:11
posted 31 January 2010 19:56
posted 01 February 2010 08:19
-- sounds like he's got some good credentials, aside from the golf score. <hehe>
posted 05 February 2010 15:38
..I'll be thinking for a bit.
